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Proposed change to shuttle missions - end the frustration
Posted: 13 May 2017 02:13 PM   [ Ignore ]  
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This is not a direct gripe about the rng, it has worked in my favor in the past and then there are events like this one where I have failed more often than succeeded with 94%+ shuttle missions. Hey it can happen right. But how about if you could not fail shuttle missions and instead the time to complete them was related to the %. So a 3 hour mission with 100% takes 3 hours, at 50% it takes 6, 75% it take 4.5 etc. If you can get over 100% it cuts the time down. I think that would certainly put an end to the frustration of failing constantly with high % and complaining about the RNG.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 02:18 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 1 ]  
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I’d settle for 100% success guarantees success every time. I’ve failed 100% shuttles several times now.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 02:25 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 2 ]  
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captain jalad - 13 May 2017 02:13 PM

So a 3 hour mission with 100% takes 3 hours, at 50% it takes 6, 75% it take 4.5 etc. If you can get over 100% it cuts the time down.

It takes longer for a lower success %? Do you mean you want every shuttle to be guaranteed (just with different durations)?

That would mean people with weaker crew would take much longer to complete their missions compared to people with stronger crew and therefore will complete far fewer missions during an event though…

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Posted: 13 May 2017 02:47 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 3 ]  
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[NDQ] A Blues fan - 13 May 2017 02:25 PM
captain jalad - 13 May 2017 02:13 PM

So a 3 hour mission with 100% takes 3 hours, at 50% it takes 6, 75% it take 4.5 etc. If you can get over 100% it cuts the time down.

It takes longer for a lower success %? Do you mean you want every shuttle to be guaranteed (just with different durations)?

That would mean people with weaker crew would take much longer to complete their missions compared to people with stronger crew and therefore will complete far fewer missions during an event though…

Yes 100% guaranteed missions, just the time difference depending on how strong the crew is. Yes weaker crew might go on fewer missions, however they may well gain more points than failing and getting locked at 1200 - 1800 for the missions compared to 4k.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 02:57 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 4 ]  
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I’d rather they just make the percentage more linear, and have a 100% point, so the difficulty is more transparent and trustworthy.  the current system, with rounded 100s that can fail, and zeros that pass 15% of the time just is too much smoke and mirrors and people don’t trust the system.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 03:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 5 ]  
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Roonis - 13 May 2017 02:57 PM

I’d rather they just make the percentage more linear, and have a 100% point, so the difficulty is more transparent and trustworthy.  the current system, with rounded 100s that can fail, and zeros that pass 15% of the time just is too much smoke and mirrors and people don’t trust the system.

Agreed.
Either they should display that calculated success rate and never show 100% success rate (since under the calculation there is always a small chance for failure )  Or, scrap it and give us a level where the missions are 100% successful. I would say on highest difficulty , if one could cover all slots with a skill 1000 and higher , that would be 100% success. Not sure how many levels of difficulty, but maybe the easiest should be crew with 10 for skills in crew slots for 100% success. Keep in mind, that as long the crew average for the required skills in each crew slot meets that level of difficulty’s min value iit is 100% success. I would also go back to the old way of doing AND and OR. I also forgot about boost, so maybe 1000 needs to be adjusted up. 

To determine in-between levels   Probably would need something on the log scale. So second easiest would be 20, next 50, next maybe 100.
Not sure how many levels of difficulty there are. Might not be a limit on normal shuttle missions. But on events there is a limit. But if no limit, normally I definitely would have a limit.

I am not even sure, this behind the scenes difficulty is the way to go either. Probably necessary for faction events. But with non event shuttles maybe we should be able to choose how difficult a mission we run. This would then require info on what is a possible item return for that difficulty. Which we all would like to know.
  Because, unless changed, I do not think superrare items are possible on low difficulty. 

EDIT: the easiest thing they can do now, is just give us the actual success rate. With the max rate being 99%. At least we would then pretty much match with our results.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 04:27 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 6 ]  
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Roonis - 13 May 2017 02:57 PM

I’d rather they just make the percentage more linear, and have a 100% point, so the difficulty is more transparent and trustworthy.  the current system, with rounded 100s that can fail, and zeros that pass 15% of the time just is too much smoke and mirrors and people don’t trust the system.

Roonis hit on the key problem. The lack of transparency. Everything is behind the scenes. Easy solution show us the actual success rate. And, tell us what level of difficulty we are at. Event faction missions at least will telll us in a way the difficulty. To find it , we have to view the shuttle mission as in progress, click on that reward icon, and see what value it is. That value is what difficulty we are at, still is not a clear indication. But, I think we all know 2 is the easiest and most of us know 4000 is the highest

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Posted: 13 May 2017 07:58 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 7 ]  
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For me, a welcome change to shuttles would be there if failure would give you 1/3 of the rewards that a success would. That way it wasn’t a complete waste of time and when bad RNG happened it wouldn’t be as painful.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 08:34 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 8 ]  
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I would enjoy a system that didn’t have success chance at all, but instead scaled the rewards to the total “points” your selected crew contribute to the mission. Maybe add a chance for higher rewards than you are capable of “scoring” up to, with that “bonus chance” dependent on crew attributes (i.e. Desperate, Resourceful, etc.).

No more having to run countless failing missions for that one Cardassian emblem you need, and now crew attributes become relevant too.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 08:52 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 9 ]  
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CyberViking85 - 13 May 2017 08:34 PM

I would enjoy a system that didn’t have success chance at all, but instead scaled the rewards to the total “points” your selected crew contribute to the mission. Maybe add a chance for higher rewards than you are capable of “scoring” up to, with that “bonus chance” dependent on crew attributes (i.e. Desperate, Resourceful, etc.).

No more having to run countless failing missions for that one Cardassian emblem you need, and now crew attributes become relevant too.

wow this is a fantastic idea.  I actually don’t run shuttles outside of events.  ‘Why?  You’re crazy!’  Well the reason is that usually I would run to get a specific item.  Except for a few items there is such a low chance of getting something specific that I am discouraged.  Shuttles are useful on a yearly scale and if you don’t send every day they become useless.  Also with a strong crew for a moderate to low spender and a 70% failure rate which actually equates to around 50% in practice it’s just not worth it.  The system you describe would be worth it to me and I don’t really see why it would cost DB anything.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 08:55 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 10 ]  
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70% success not failure.  they system would not allow me to edit - quite irritating.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 09:01 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 11 ]  
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V. - 13 May 2017 08:55 PM

70% success not failure.  they system would not allow me to edit - quite irritating.

FYI, having run into this many times with this dumb forum software, I’ve found that it’s often small changes that will make your reply not go through. The easiest way to solve this is to add a bunch of line returns at the end of what you’ve written, with a “This is not spam” or something at the bottom (even if it wasn’t a spam-related error you received). Oh, and make sure it’s been at least 60 seconds since you last attempted or completed an edit or an original post.

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Posted: 13 May 2017 11:10 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 12 ]  
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I actually think what might be an interesting change would be you pick the number of points to try and score for each shuttle and you get a difficulty that reflects that goal.  This would be similar to how it is now, except that you don’t have to grind to get up to the higher level points.  You could also theoretically just hover at a higher success rate (without slipping down) that fits where your crew currently is.  This could provide a more steady stream of points.  This would also allow to take a chance at higher points with a similar chance of a high payout (gamble vs having to attempt just to get difficulty level down).

For example:
So you could theoretically use your best crew for, lets say, a 3500 VP mission, maybe yields a 60-70% with multiple event crew.
Use 2 shuttles at 1500 with a high success rate.
And maybe gamble with the 4th.  Try a 2nd 3500 with only a 30% rate.

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Posted: 14 May 2017 06:28 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 13 ]  
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Everything is based on RNG in this game and I do not think that is going to change, no matter how frustrating, irritating and pointless people find it, myself included.

I could live with a RNG system like this IF DisruptorBeam would make it more then just a win/lose situation.
For example, I just failed my 9 hour mission? Give me some freaking trainers, everyone learns, even from mistakes! But don’t give me the freaking finger just because your RNG decided to screw me over.

So many good suggestions on this thread, please consider them! Add some rewards, even to failures! People hate it when they get absolutely nothing!

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Posted: 14 May 2017 10:10 AM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 14 ]  
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[DB-DoBetter] Dragoshan - 14 May 2017 06:28 AM

I could live with a RNG system like this IF DisruptorBeam would make it more then just a win/lose situation.

For example, I just failed my 9 hour mission? Give me some freaking trainers, everyone learns, even from mistakes! But don’t give me the freaking finger just because your RNG decided to screw me over.

So many good suggestions on this thread, please consider them! Add some rewards, even to failures! People hate it when they get absolutely nothing!

I agree with the observation of learning from failures and moving away from a win/lose duality. I submit the following concept for consideration:

Scaled success/failure spectrum for shuttle/faction missions

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Posted: 14 May 2017 01:39 PM   [ Ignore ]   [ # 15 ]  
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As it was explained to me, more than once—0% missions can pass because all crew have hidden skills, some percentage of their lowest skill that I can’t remember and don’t know if I was ever told the accurate number anyway.  So, that 0% mission could actually be 4%, and we all know 4% hits far more often than it should according to the patent-pending DB Curve of (Im)Probability, while 75%+ hits far less than it should.

It’s been nearly a year and a half of shuttles failing or passing arbitrarily and to date nothing has changed in that regard, so it’s reasonable to assume nothing is going to change.

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